Jack Dorsey launching a new messaging app (Bitchat)

Link to Github.

Has anyone seen this? Would love to hear some expert opinion before it blows up anyway since it’s trending atm.

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Looks extremely interesting, a messenger optimized for Bluetooth mesh networks would be really cool to see. I’d like to see it formally audited but definitely something to keep an eye on.

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It has great use cases for sure. But I would still like to be able to use this via the internet.

Related: xkcd: Standards

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How is it any better or worse than Briar?

At most, I can see this being used for large protests or hidden conversations within the local vicinity. Can someone elaborate whether it can be used for any other purpose besides these two?

Besides being an established project, Briar can be used over the internet and TOR. Bluetooth is more of a secondary feature.

On the otherhand, Bitchat relies purely on Bluetooth mesh networks and is P2P.

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Wouldn’t Apple Messages with all parties having advanced data protection turned offer the same benefits as this?

I’m really puzzled where these messaging apps become useful. The range isn’t large enough for a big household, let alone educational facility or WAN to cover where people live.

Sure some people like to setup their own antennas etc but usually those are radio amateurs and the ranges are vastly superior.

It probably works nicely in a protest to share e.g. filmed evidence, but bringing the phone there makes you trackable.

No you’d still need internet, and iMessage doesn’t really try to hide who’s talking to who.

Future support for WiFi direct is anticipated to increased recipient range

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a wild android port appears! GitHub - permissionlesstech/bitchat-android: bluetooth mesh chat, IRC vibes

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No. Ivan the Terrible would just order the Internet shut down and now iMessage no longer works.

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Seconding meshtastic. No cell phone towers needed, just you and your meshtastic device.

At least until they bring signal jammers.

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Perfect explanation.

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Radocea demonstrated a man-in-the-middle (MitM) attack that exploits Bitchat’s broken identity authentication system, allowing attackers to impersonate trusted contacts. The app also currently doesn’t reach the industry standard level of forward secrecy; the app has forward secrecy at the “session” level, but the encryption keys are static for each “session.”

So it lacks basic features like forward secrecy and a proper authentication system?

At least Dorsey is being honest about how unfinished it is lol.

Not really. But it is great he is listening and improving.

Dorsey deserves criticism for the way he framed the release. Despite including security warnings in the README, he immediately discussed using Bitchat in high-risk scenarios like protests in Kenya, which are exactly the sensitive use cases his own warnings advised against. When you’re Jack Dorsey and know the tech media will amplify anything you release, you have a responsibility to be more careful about messaging and expectations.

I can see an app like this and Briar also being good on emergency ency situations. Like if the electrical grid gets knocked out in an area, at least people can still communicate for those who can generate power for charging a phone but don’t have cell service. But even in that scenario it depends on enough people having Bluetooth on to use it. Idk if it would compete with just getting the word around in person.

Bluetooth Mesh works great on paper until you realize that the network effect exists. At that point, you might as well learn ham radio or yell out things in your vicinity during a crisis.

What would be interesting is whether these apps can break this paradox and increase adoption after a crisis. Maybe it won’t be useful on day zero, but a few early adopters can publicize its usefulness as a small case study.

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I think for it to be viable, you’d need to have pretty high population density, and a majority of people using the app. In my experience bluetooth distance is more or less “shouting distance” so it seems it would only be practical for dissemination of info if there were a critical mass of users in a small area that could act as relays (e.g. a mass protest or march, a multi-story apartment building, dorm, a concert or football game.

Techies investing billions (not really) to reinvent an over-engineered version of the town crier and/or ‘word of mouth’ :rofl: (I’m mostly just being facetious here, there may be some great comparative advantages for such messengers)

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