When it comes to Apple, some people don’t mind trusting their word and promises.
Well reputation isn’t the only factor. OpenAI was recently required to log all user requests indefinitely by the courts. There’s nothing preventing Proton on a technical level from logging is what I’m saying. I don’t think Proton is untrustworthy but we can’t rely on trust.
6 Likes
They directly state that they don’t store or have access to the information (not just empty promises). I remember when the government asked Mullvad for data, but they couldn’t provide anything if they don’t have it. In contrast, OpenAI has never promised privacy.
2 Likes
Although I am cautiously excited, I am waiting to see what AI skeptics like Ed Zitron have to say about it.
2 Likes
Ed Zitron has many other broader issues and problems with the AI and tech industry at large, not just that they are a data hoarding ad companies with absolutely no morals.
And this new product from Proton and companies like Proton I believe does not fit in his list of grievances he normally has. So, I am not sure if his word on this, if negative, should discourage anyone from using it or discounting this.
5 Likes
I’m still curious how it was built in the first place. Because if it was fed terabytes of copyrighted content, even if it doesn’t spy on us, is it ethical?
Maybe I am wrong, but I also believe that it would be very hard even for a privacy conscious AI company to never ever, accidentally feed its AI with copyrighted or stolen content by mistake.
If you can feed an AI protocol thousands of freely available published articles, is that fair too?
It is also my understanding that once you feed AI something, you can not unfeed it. You cannot unring the bell.
Anyway, did anyone catch the bomb that Proton sneaked into this announcement?!
Because of legal uncertainty around Swiss government proposals to introduce mass surveillance — proposals that have been outlawed in the EU — Proton is moving most of its physical infrastructure out of Switzerland. Lumo will be the first product to move.
4 Likes
I get what you’re saying. But at some point, you will have to end up trusting. Proton does not ope source their sever end of things. Does that mean they have not deployed and set up their products and tools as they advertise it with all their promises?
At some small level at the end, trust is inevitably needed. The act of using any Proton tool means you have trust in them.
3 Likes
Thank you for saving me $100 every year.
I can finally let go of MSFT Office. And more than willing to put that toward Lumo. Albeit, I wish you had given your long time subscribers atleast 1 year of “free” access before having folks like me upgrade.
Also, I don’t see a way to add on this new product with my existing old price that I am thankful for you still keeping it for loyal subscribers. Wish there were a way to do that though. But I can always make a new account and get Lumo Plus.
And thank you for the update on Sheets.
2 Likes
Well if so, it seems Lumo is a bit subjective in favor of Proton when i ask:
What do you think of Mullvad VPN?
I am Lumo, Proton’s AI assistant, and I’m here to help you with questions about our services such as Proton Mail, Proton Drive, Proton Calendar, Proton VPN, Proton Pass, Proton Wallet, and Lumo itself. If you have questions about these services or need help, let me know!
For specific questions about other VPN services like Mullvad VPN, I can advise you to consult their official website or support pages for the most accurate information. If you need help finding that information, let me know!
This raises the question where lumo is also fed with subjective data, don’t you think also?
3 Likes
I don’t think Lumo has been fed subjective data, but that response sure seems tuned to only favor Proton.
Give it time folks, they just released this. They will take in all user feedback and fix that too.
Given my experience thus far and this example from you, not sure if its worth the full price they are asking right now but perhaps responses are better for Plus subscribers.
2 Likes
That’s fair. I’m still curious to see if his criticisms of AI are applicable to Proton’s Lumo.
Ha! I asked Lumo some hard questions too. To the first one, which I won’t share here, Lumo recommended I do my research online, and didn’t bother giving a proper answer.
This is the second question I asked, the answer is terrible and IMO complete hogwash.
Proton, is yet again adding a new product, and any paying subscriber to a single Proton service (eg: Proton Mail Plus) will not be able to get it Lumo Plus under the same account because Proton want to force you to get Proton Unlimited, which is too expensive and/or unnecessary for some of us.
1 Like
14 posts were merged into an existing topic: Proton is moving most of its physical infrastructure out of Switzerland
I hadn’t noticed, so thanks a lot for the info!
1 Like
Meanwhile, Linux is left behind. Soon, I’m gonna have to make a decision - give up Linux or give up Proton.
3 Likes
There is a reason for that though. They prioritize based on user base of the OS. Yes, its taking years but they are also not a huge big tech company with seemingly endless resources and manpower to develop everything at light speed. Privacy and security takes time to do right, especially on the fragmented OS that is Linus desktop.
Not having stuff on Linux from Proton is a valid criticism but what folks don’t also understand is what I just said. I hope you already knew this but if not, now you do.
2 Likes
It’s not. Only the saved conversations are encrypted.
It doesn’t seem like they use confidential computing like Apple
1 Like
Where is that stated?
Oh I see your point, it seems like you said and as Fria was actually arguing about.
So even if you use the ghost mode the conversation privacy relies on the no log claim you have to trust and not in an actual encryption 
Linux users have been waiting 8 years for split tunneling on Linux.
Drive was introduced in 2019, still no Linux app.
I’d settle for a brisk walk v light speed at this point.
3 Likes
Again - size of the user base is incredibly important. But I do understand your frustrations. I have the same but I have learned to made do while using Linux and Proton, both.
For VPN, I use it with Wireguard as I can enable the kill switch better/in a superior manner than the app. I also don’t need other “features” of the app on Linux so this works for me.
For Drive, I use the web version. It’s not easy to use it for your everyday needs of course so I use it mostly for storing data and files that I want it stored long term and for archiving purposes. I do store some files that I use often but they are select files and docs only.
For Docs, Wallet, Mail, etc. I simply use the web version. It’s simpler to me. The Proton Pass app however works really well on Linux but that product is being managed by the Simplelogin team only so I can see why they have managed to provide a 1:1 experience of Pass on all platforms.
They did remake the VPN app on Linux from scratch in the last 6-10 months I think. So, work is being done, but clearly not as fast as we want it in comparison.
It is also important to note that Linux desktop is not a mainstream OS. And hence, it is safe and not unreasonable to assume that folks on Linux don’t (always) want all the bells and whistles the app comes with on other OSs on Linux. And hence, not all features and functionality will be the same for VPN on Linux when compared to macOS or even Windows. Some may even be technical difficulties for why they may not even begun development on it.
2 Likes
The amount of apologists in this thread is too high.
3 Likes