Bitcoin for Signal - Private Messaging Needs Private Money

[User53]

@Anonymous95

Why does a chat app need any “integrated” cryptocurrency functionality? All cryptocurrencies are internet-native. It’s very easy already to use any cryptocurrency over Signal (or any other E2EE messenger…definitely wouldn’t trust a non-E2EE messenger for sending and receiving cryptocurrency info). You can simply send a chat message to a contact with your receiving address or vice versa, then copy the address/payment request to a wallet on your phone (or on a different device) and pay it. It’s incredibly simple and, again, you can just use whatever cryptocurrency you and your contacts want to use.

The point is to make the workflow more smoth.
Instead of back and forth copying addresses or tokens, you just have a send money button inside the app, then you and se receiver sees a simple message that represents the payment instead of a large token.

[Anonymous95 (Anonymous)]

It’s already smooth if you just use/recognize URIs.

[lyricism]

After reading a bit more about Cashu I think it’s a non-starter for integration with Signal in the current legal landscape. It is likely that as a custodial protocol, any Cashu mints would meet the definition of a money services business in the US and jurisdictions with similar regulations and thus be required to implement extensive KYC and AML regimes which I doubt Signal wants to impose on their users even if it’s an optional feature. My understanding is that any service which takes custody of money or assets representing money and facilitates their transfer to another person qualifies as a money services business, and I don’t see an argument for how Cashu doesn’t fit that definition.

I am not a lawyer and am entirely a layman in the field of financial regulations, so take that opinion with a grain of salt.

[Pedja]

Not interested. Signal is for secure messaging, not a crypto wallet. MobileCoin exists and is basically useless, and adding more crypto features will lead to enshittification.

[User53]

@Anonymous95

It’s already smooth if you just use/recognize URIs.

But paying to URIs weakens the privacy.
If you send the token over the chat and directly auto reddem it you don’t have such issues and a smother experience

[Open_Software]

@User53

Its all depends ony many factors.
Cashu would need to get a lot more adoption so that some mints have enough user’s to get even 1% of Moneros anonymite set.
But I have to admit that if Signal would host their own mint, the anonymity set could probably be larger the of Monero

Mostly correct, but the point is that Signal should adopt Cashu and then we have a very big anonymity set.

@lyricism

After reading a bit more about Cashu I think it’s a non-starter for integration with Signal in the current legal landscape. It is likely that as a custodial protocol, any Cashu mints would meet the definition of a money services business in the US and jurisdictions with similar regulations and thus be required to implement extensive KYC and AML regimes which I doubt Signal wants to impose on their users even if it’s an optional feature. My understanding is that any service which takes custody of money or assets representing money and facilitates their transfer to another person qualifies as a money services business, and I don’t see an argument for how Cashu doesn’t fit that definition.

I am not a lawyer and am entirely a layman in the field of financial regulations, so take that opinion with a grain of salt.

There are allready many Cashu mints and none of them requires KYC/AML, so we can assume that this isn’t a problem.

[lyricism]

@Open_Software

There are allready many Cashu mints and none of them requires KYC/AML, so we can assume that this isn’t a problem.

A lot of people violating the law is not evidence that the action is not a violation of the law. If your question is why they aren’t being prosecuted, it’s likely because they’re just flying under the radar at the moment. Signal is massive and wouldn’t be in the same position, and certainly has actual risk analysts and lawyers who would not sign off on taking that chance.

[Open_Software]

@lyricism

A lot of people violating the law is not evidence that the action is not a violation of the law. If your question is why they aren’t being prosecuted, it’s likely because they’re just flying under the radar at the moment. Signal is massive and wouldn’t be in the same position, and certainly has actual risk analysts and lawyers who would not sign off on taking that chance.

I don’t talk about some random anonymous mints but about official companies
The most popular mint at the moment seams to be Minibits which also is a Cashu app.
Minibits is a project of Bitango Technologies. s.r.o. which is registered in the EU

[lyricism]

That doesn’t contradict anything I said and is kind of a non-sequitur.

[Open_Software]

If I see people doing behavior X in the eyesight of CCTV and police officers then I will assume that X is not illegal until proven otherwise