Add Navigation (GPS) tools

Thought i would bring this up since i saw no related results when searching.

Since using GPS navigation is really common and rife with privacy issues, I think it would be nice to add a section about more private options. There are some applications that serve as alternatives to Google Maps for directions like OSMAnd, Organic Maps, Magic Earth, and others. And there’s Apple Maps as well for Apple users.

I would also be interested in a discussion evaluating how good of an alternative (privacy-wise) a standalone GPS device is, I’ve been strongly considering a Garmin Drivesmart device.

:slightly_smiling_face: Thoughts?

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These dedicated GPS units often require proprietary software (like Windows-specific programs) to update the included map data, and sometimes even charge for the yearly map updates.

Whereas the quality of the Open treetMap data is highly dependent on region, it can be updated hourly for free via OsmAnd and is fully FOSS.

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The roads have signs for that.

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I think something OpenStreetMap-based like Organic Maps is the obvious choice. But the main downside of all of these open source apps is that they don’t have traffic infos, which is a very important part of turn-by-turn navigation.

For that I’m currently using HERE WeGo for that as they seem kind of okay in terms of privacy and have a navigation quality similar to Google Maps.

Would you be interested in a new page on PG for maps & navigation apps?

I’m happy to start a pull request if this is of interest.

Some navigation/map apps I’m aware of are: Organic Maps, OSMand, Magic Earth, HERE WeGo, KartaGPS, Google Maps, Apple Maps, Waze, TomTom Go, Mapquest, Yandex, Petal, Maps.me, Sygic

In scope:

  • mobile navigation & maps apps

Not in scope:

  • web maps, as you don’t use them for turn-by-turn navigation which is probably the most sensitive thing from a privacy perspective as it reveals your location and the places you visit
  • hardware sat-nats (i.e. some TomTom or Garmin device you buy yourself or whatever navigation system is built into your car), as it is harder to do proper research and also doubtful that they respect your privacy in the first place

I would propose some criteria like these, which should exclude most of them:

Minimum criteria
Privacy

  • Must not require users to create an account with them.
  • Must not collect PII per their privacy policy.
  • Must not collect location data as per privacy policy. If the user opts in to sharing location data (e.g. for use in live traffic info) the data should be anonymized and deleted after no longer than [24 hours?] as per privacy policy.
  • Must not upload search history (only stored locally in the app).
  • App telemetry (if any) can be turned off.

Features

  • Maps can be downloaded and used entirely offline.
  • Has route planning and turn-by-turn navigation for car, bicycle, foot
  • Has route planning for public transport

Best-case criteria

  • Open source apps
  • Live traffic information used for route planning
  • Detailed information on points of interest, e.g. shop opening times and reviews
  • Has additional views such as topographic maps, satellite images, or streetview

I suspect that OSMand, Organic Maps, Magic Earth and HERE WeGo will pass, maybe some others, maybe some fewer - it would require some digging in the privacy policies.

Maybe could add a summary table at the top with some additional infos such as platforms (Android, iOS, web), map data (OpenStreetMap, others), and notable features (e.g. whether it has satellite images or streetview)

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I’m all for it, it would be very interesting indeed, there are alternatives to Google Maps, Google Waze and Apple Plan, we might as well promote them and support projects that respect privacy and open source.

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There seems to be a fair bit of overlap between this topic and the more active add Organic Maps topic. Adding Organic Maps would seemingly inherently require creating a navigation section.

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Just quickly checking the minimum criteria to narrow down the list:

Most certainly fine

Might be fine, need a closer look

Probably not

Clear fail

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iirc HERE had some facebook trackers & partnership, but its been a few years since I checked

OSMAnd also really excels for those who want to walk or cycle to places

overall Organic Maps is a very simple “just works” for getting to a destination, but OSMAnd is a true navigation app that does nearly everything one expects

it also is possible to get traffic info overlayed from Google Maps in OSMAnd

1 Like

It’s just the Facebook Login which makes sense because if you choose to log in (completely optional) you can either make a HERE account or use your Facebook account. Don’t know if that can really be called a tracker.

It’s a nice trick, but unfortunately it is ignored by the turn-by-turn navigation. You can just manually try to circumvent e.g. a traffic jam on the motorway, but it doesn’t really help much with city traffic where every road is shown as orange or red.

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Not that I’m advocating for it because I don’t think they are a private option, but Apple Maps is available in beta on the web: https://beta.maps.apple.com

Only on Windows/macOS/iPadOS which makes it useless for me and seems extremely unlikely to ever change. Obviously you could change the user-agent but then you’d have to use Firefox Beta.

The roads have signs for navigation as well.

Had a closer look at the three “maybe” apps.

HERE WeGo

Some features of the Service may require the use of HERE account, for example when you want to synchronise your collections. You may continue to use the other features of the Service without signing in. When you sign-up for a HERE account, we collect your name, email address and your date of birth.

This is completely optional. Don’t make an account or give fake info.

Our Service makes use of information about your actual location (“Location Data”) and information about places (“Place Information”). Location Data reveals where you currently are or where you have been. Location Data is based on available positioning methods, such as Assisted GPS.

Unless otherwise stated, we use random identifiers in connection with your Location Data that do not identify you personally.

The Service may send your Location Data to HERE when you use location enabled features of the Service, such as enable navigation, ask information about nearby services or offerings, use search features, provide you with relevant offers from Transport Providers and public transportation vendors, as well as when the Service asks for new maps for new areas you have navigated into. Location Data may also be collected when you use the traffic feature for service improvement purposes without identifying you personally. Place Information may be sent to HERE for example when you synchronise your collections.

tl;dr location data does “not identify you personally”

You may participate to improving our services. (…) The Service may include HERE-provided positioning services, including Wi-Fi or other network-based positioning methods. The use of these technologies and positioning services may involve sharing any or all of the following with HERE: Location Data, speed, direction and timestamp; number of satellites used in positioning; parameters of nearby mobile network towers; parameters of nearby Wi-Fi routers and/or Bluetooth® beacons; Mobile Country Code and Mobile Network Code of your mobile subscription. This information is sent to us when you use the Service, after which it is deleted from your device. We do not use this data to identify you personally or combine this information with your HERE account.

This is opt-in (“do you want to help us improve?” kind of question when you set up the app), so irrelevant.

When you decide to use the Traffic features of the Service, Location Data, speed, direction and timestamp are sent from your device to HERE to detect traffic jams, traffic patterns, changed road conditions and other such conditions so that we can provide you with better service. This information is analysed to distinguish independent routes and traffic patterns and contains an identifier, which is persistent for the duration of the route. You may choose the extent to which you contribute to the improvement of our services. In the context of Traffic features of the Service, you can provide us with the Location Data, speed, direction and timestamp, along with the changing identifier, either when you use the Service, when the Service is not actively used or even when the applicable Service is closed. If the application is closed, we’ll attempt to detect when you’re driving to enable the background collection. We may use methods available from the mobile operating system or other contextual information to detect driving scenarios. You can always change your Traffic preferences in the application settings either in Settings or About. This information is sent to us when you use the Service, after which it is deleted from your device.

This is opt-in (only enabled if you choose to use the traffic feature). There is an identifier that is “persistent for the duration of the route” but will be changed for each route to a “random identifier (…) that do not identify you personally”.

In addition to personal data that you actively provide when you create a HERE account and/or book a ride with a Transport Provider, after you download and install the application, or book a ride via HERE WeGo, certain technical details of your client as well as your transactions with HERE may be automatically collected by HERE, including your device ID or any other unique identifier, advertiser ID (if applicable), publisher ID (if applicable), the device on which you installed the application and/or the device via which you use the Service, operator, device type and model, device manufacturer, application version, operating system and version, browser type and version, city, language, referral URL, IP address, local time, push notification settings, screen resolution, memory and if your GPS is enabled/disabled in your application.

I don’t like how this kind of telemetry seems to be mandatory.

We do not associate your Location Data or Place Information with your other personal information, such as HERE account, unless you have asked us to do so. For example, if you save a place to your collection, we do not combine this information with your Location Data unless you have asked us to do so. Please note that we may use and/or share your non-personal data, including in aggregated form, without restriction, including with existing and prospective third-party business partners, researchers and advertisers.

Good that it’s anonymized, bad that they still “may” sell data to advertisers.

The Service may include provision of location based advertising or other similar content. For example if you ask for weather information you may be served with advertising content tailored to that location. The Service may also include behaviorally profiled advertisements. For the purposes of providing relevant advertisements to you, we may share your device specific advertising ID to advertising networks.

I don’t like mention of the word “advertising network”.

The Service offers a variety of choices to allow you to control how your Location Data and other information are collected. You may use the Service in offline or online mode. No Location Data or other information is sent to HERE if you only use the Service in offline mode. You choose whether to enable the Traffic feature of the Service and if you participate to HERE Improvement Program. You may withdraw your consent, at any time, via the application Setting. (…) You can only enable the Traffic features if you also contribute to the improvement of our services. Once enabled, you can choose the extent to which you contribute to the improvement of our services: only when the application is running or when the application is running or closed.

Onboarding process when you install the app:

  1. Share traffic info? (send info on your vehicle’s location) Yes/No; need to say Yes to get live traffic info for route planning
  2. Improve tha app and location info? (all data is anonymised) Yes/No
  3. Download maps for offline use? Yes/No
  4. No telemetry settings in app.

Notable app features:

  • Routing for car, bicycle, walking, taxi, public transport
  • Live traffic info (opt-in)
  • Speed camera warnings
  • Offline maps
  • Satellite map and terrain map
  • Shop info (like opening times) and reviews (from Yelp)
  • Decent search function

Magic Earth

Very generic sounding privacy policy mentioning stuff like applying for credit and entering a sweepstake. Not specific to the app.

At times we may make certain personal information available to strategic partners that work with us to provide products and services, or that help us market to customers. Personal information will only be shared by us to provide or improve our products, services and advertising; it will not be shared with third parties for their marketing purposes.

You don’t need to give the app any info so this seems irrelevant.

To provide location-based services on our products, we and our partners and licensees may collect, use, and share precise location data, including the real-time geographic location of your computer or device. This location data is collected anonymously in a form that does not personally identify you and is used by us and our partners and licensees to provide and improve location-based products and services. For example, we may share geographic location with application providers when you opt in to their location services.

In other words, location data is anonymised.

App onboarding:

  1. Nothing. It shows you an app and that’s it. No “accept X?” questions. So I guess it means you don’t share any data at all?

Notable app features:

  • Routing for car, bicycle, walking, taxi, public transport
  • Live traffic info (country list)
  • Speed camera warnings
  • Offline maps
  • Satellite and terrain maps

Search function is not quite as good as I hoped, e.g. doesn’t understand UK postcodes.

Does NOT seem to have shop infos or reviews.


Petal Maps

https://privacy.consumer.huawei.com/legal/petal-maps/privacy-statement.htm?code=FR&branchid=5&version=20300300&language=en-US

We will collect and process the following data:

•HUAWEI ID account information: such as the account identifier, service token and the profile picture, which are processed by Petal Maps on the device.

•Location information: such as location data based on the GPS and network location (Wi-Fi and Cell ID) received on your device from your location services provider.

•Network information: such as IP address.

•Browser information (only when using the Petal Maps website): such as cookies (only essential cookies).

•Device information: such as device random identifier, device type, device name, ROM version, operating system version, and language.

•Service usage information (not all of the listed data here will be processed for the iOS version of the service as the features are limited there): such as frequently used addresses, search terms (name of the place, address, phone number, and longitude/latitude), search results (e.g. POIs), favorite places, start and end times of navigation, navigation routes, driving navigation information (longitude/latitude, language, and driving speed), traffic information, pictures provided when reviewing a place, comments and reviews made for places in the map, nearby bus stops, status of consent to marketing communication (switch on/off), search keywords and results (which will not be stored), and POI information contribution (such as correcting the address of a restaurant, or opening and closing hours of a business).

(…)

Hmm. Not too great. But the Huawei ID is not needed and the other info is hopefully anonymised?

In the app itself it shows a slightly different privacy policy in an in-app browser (no URL shown) which says that the location data stored is only approximate to 1100 meters and stored with a “random identifier not directly linkable to you as a specific user”.

How we use your data.

(…)

Marketing purposes, including communicating about our offerings, sales promotion, and other marketing purposes, as well as creating aggregated target groups for marketing. You can object to such data processing as described in Section 5.6 below.

Personalized recommendations (this feature is not available in the iOS app version): If you have the Petal Maps personalized recommendation feature enabled, your search history, terms, and results, approximate location, and HUAWEI ID information will be processed on your device only to provide you with search content tailored for you, displaying results such as restaurants and cafes that may be of interest to you based on your locally processed data. We only store the data on your device and will not transfer it to anywhere else. You can object to the personalization anytime by going to Petal Maps > Me > Settings > Privacy management > Personalized content on your device to disable this feature. Your search results will then be provided without any personalization and all the results will be shown to you only based on your search terms.

When you give consent, your location data will be processed to provide you with location based services such as navigation and positioning. You can withdraw your consent at any time by opening Petal Maps and going to Me > Settings > Privacy management > Location data consent.

Direct marketing purpose (this feature is not available in the iOS app version): When you are using Petal Maps while logged in with your HUAWEI ID, we may send you marketing communication via push notifications, emails, SMS messages, and instant messages to your device to inform you about new features, events, and offers from us and our partners, after you have given consent in the Petal Maps app. You can withdraw your consent at any time by going to Petal Maps > Me > Settings > Privacy management and disabling Notifications for the Petal Maps specific consent, and by going to Settings > HUAWEI ID > Privacy center > Receive messages on your device for the general consent.

At least all of this seems to be optional. Note that in practice you’ll need to share the location data to actually use the app for navigation etc.

App onboarding experience:

  1. “your data will be used for providing this service as well as for promotional and development purposes”. Agree/Disagree? Need to agree to continue
  2. “let Petal process your location data?” Yes/No → you have to say Yes if you want to be able to locate yourself on the map or use the navigation
  3. In-app privacy settings:
  • Improve the map experience (pseudonymous data for location or ID) → can be disabled
  • Location data processing (for navigation and traffic conditions) → can be disabled but will lose these functions
  • Search suggestions → can be disabled
  • Navigation data sharing (share location with TomTom to improve traffic info) → disabled by default

Notable app features:

  • Routing for car, bicycle, walking, taxi
  • Live traffic info
  • Offline maps
  • Terrain map (NO satellite map)
  • Shop info (like opening times) and reviews (from Tripadvisor)
  • Decent search function

Public transport routing is advertised in the app description but not available in the app. Seems to be deleted which I think should be an automatic disqualification.

Also there’s a booking dot com ad shown on the bottom of the search/function widget. Bad taste.


Interim conclusion

Magic Earth: Good from a privacy perspective as they don’t seem to collect any data (?), but seemed a bit rough around the edges for my personal taste, such as mediocre search and missing shop/POI info. Also it depends on OSM data which is hit and miss depending on where you are.

HERE WeGo: Not that great as they do collect some data but it’s either optional or anonymised. Can be used with good privacy if you don’t need live traffic info and use offline maps. I think it’s worth including as it has some advantages over Magic Earth, OSMand, and Organic Maps such as shop infos/reviews and - honestly - better map data overall.

Petal Maps: I don’t get good vibes here. The privacy policy is the least assuring of the three and while they have a good search and good shop info/reviews, they removed public transport routing from the app and don’t have a satellite view. Map data is from TomTom which should be very good, but otherwise I don’t think this should be recommended. I mean, it’s Huawei, would be strange to see them recommended here!

tl;dr I would propose including Organic Maps, OSMand, Magic Earth and HERE WeGo

Organic OSMAnd Magic Earth HERE
License free free proprietary proprietary
Privacy policy great great great decent
Map data OSM OSM OSM HERE
Traffic info No No* Yes Yes
Satellite maps No Yes Yes Yes
Streetview No Yes** No No
Public transport Yes Yes Yes Yes
Offline maps Yes Yes Yes Yes
Shop info Yes*** Yes*** No? Yes

*can overlay Google Maps but not usable for routing
**Mapillary, unforunately with very limited coverage
***OSM data which unfortunately tends to be outdated and limited in my experience

7 Likes

That really depends on where you live and how active the OSM community is there.
OSM is often the most up to date map here (regarding shops and other businesses).

4 Likes

In Rome,Italy, organic Maps and Osmand doesn’t give informations about public transport. Now i use moovit that works well with public transport. Moovit use Osm data and Cotral( local public trasport company) data.

This is great. Thank you so much for this. For some reason I never looked at Here Maps, but their privacy policy is much better than what I assumed, and the app has very clear toggles for enabling/disabling the features and what data will be used and how on enabling them. Also a clear button to delete all the data.

Their live traffic data seems accurate and up to date in my area. Unlike OSM in my area, all street numbers seem to be there. There are many businesses missing and with wrong or outdated information in my area though. Public transportation directions seem better than Google’s and about the same as OSM in my area but with a nicer UI. It doesn’t show cycle lanes, and bicycle navigation seems even worse than Google’s, OSM is king for cycling here.

I think I might be able to replace all my current Google Maps use cases with Here + Duckduckgo for business search.

I’d like to use OsmAnd for everything, but there are so many missing street numbers, that even if I use Duckduckgo for business search, once I open the address in OsmAnd it wouldn’t find it :frowning:. One day I’ll find the time to bulk import the GeoJSON with street numbers that my regional administration publishes into OSM… But it seems like quite an involved process.

I think this should be put into Best-case for two reasons.

  1. Organic Maps only has limited support (subway and buses in select cities).
  2. Checking info about transport routes on a regional/national app is probably fine* since many people will also check the same routes as you

*If you use a VPN and don’t login.

Yes, I think that’s fair. There’s also separate FOSS apps for public transport and there’s always your local public transport network’s website. So it’s doesn’t really have to be a minimum criterium.

Started a draft here: privacyguides.org/docs/maps.md at fa1bb925ba1365a2d186cda658537c9f52d8fd07 · eylenburg/privacyguides.org · GitHub

Any feedback would be much appreciated before I make a pull request.

Also (@jonah) I couldn’t figure out what to do with the icon: material/maps at the top, I assume that’s for the small logo on the ‘table of contents’ on the left but where does it pull the images from?

1 Like