Hey! That is my line! 
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I’m not sure these articles are useful for PG followers, but I think they are good for wider audience. Yes, we know all the (security) drawbacks of those phones, but it really depends on threat model and use-case.
Also, while in US, and most of western Europe, 90% of phones are Apple, Samsung or Pixel, in many other countries, majority of users choose popular and cheap(er) phones with lot of bloatware and short(er) support. I’m not saying users should disregard security (updates), but there are literally billions of insecure active phones in use for banking and government apps. Therefore, I would say security level of phones in article is ok, on-pair with majority of others, but with way better privacy.
They did mention GraphenOS in article, but unlike that one (also CalyxOS or LineageOS), those they described are actually sold buy companies with some support and warranty. It’s already to hard to convince people to switch to privacy-friendly alternatives, but if the first step is to buy a phone and install another OS, there’s no way to make significant difference in (near) future. The fact that you can buy de-googled phone and just start using it as any other is a step forward.
The only thing I don’t like is highlighting “European” in such articles, as the root cause comes from international trillion dollar corporations, not countries (or at least not at that level). So I would say the reason is to profit from this “sovereignty” politics, as for some people that would be enough. Though in this case it might makes sense, as buying physical device is not as easy as choosing or subsrcibing to privacy-friendly software, and I suppose most of their users are in Germany and rest of Europe.
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What makes this even worse is I informed Tuta last week over on Bluesky that Calyx is a dead project. The person running that account thanked me for the info but decided to either not pass along the information or didn’t believe me.
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Similar experience here which yeah that warrants an explaination about the internal processes behind articles
Just noticed that the Volla phone x23 is using a SOC from 2022 and the phone was released in May 2023. I wonder how much longer it’ll be receiving patches especially as it’s a non flagship SoC (Helio G99) with two successor chips released in 2024 and 2025.
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AI slop article describing mostly outdated devices running closed-source Android forks. Does not inspire confidence in the slightest.
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GrapheneOS supports Pixel which treats bootloader unlocking as first class citizen. Pixel warranty and support apply for hardware regardless of if you flashed an alternative OS or not. Software support is handled through their forum, similar to what even commercial providers like Apple and Lenovo do, or people can avail Google support by just reverting to stock. Just wanted to clarify.
Their point seems to be you’re not de-Googled if you use a Google phone. I think most people (me at least) think of degoogling as not using their invasive systems. The fact that GOS happens to run on Google hardware is incidental to me and actually mildly amusing in its irony. I am running a degoogled pixel 8 and convinced that is the best setup available
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Maybe I wasn’t clear, but I meant place you can go, or phone you can call if something is wrong with your device. Less experienced users, which is more than 95% of total number, don’t use support forums. In best case, some might use general discussion platforms (general topics forums, social networks) to ask experienced users for opinion or solution. I’m totally ok with flashing, reverting, experimenting with phone and PC systems, but in my circle of friends, family members and acquaintances, there is exactly one person willing to do the same out of hundred(s) of them.
I really support GrapheneOS team and like what they do, and would recommend it, but unless they start selling phones and create sales and repair network, it’s just a niche product for already small market.
Even regular Pixel is not officially available in many countries, so you need to buy it somewhere else, or on e-bay and similar 2nd hand markets. Usually without warranty.
And just to be clear - I’m not saying these phones are great, recommended to all or anything similar. It’s just that there might be users and use-cases where those would be a good choice.
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I fully agree with you.
To Tuta: If using a Pixel isn’t degoogled, neither is using an OS based on AOSP.
I think you misunderstood what he wrote.
By that logic degoogling is basically impossible. Sure, you can switch to iOS which is arguably better in some way but you’re just replacing Google with Apple so what’s the point. Pure Linux on the phone is a security nightmare and is not a real option.
You are entitled to think whatever you wish.
It seems to me that the Tuta team has developed an allergy to everything american.
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You actually said this:
Where “unlike that one” clearly means GrapheneOS does not have “some support or warranty”.
So I clarified that it does have the same warranty that Pixel and Google have, with the additional benefit of GrapheneOS forum. They clearly have some and more than some warranty and support, thus your comment could have misled someone. Whether you think Google’s support or country availability is enough or not is personal, but they do have support and warranty both.
Also I would not be so confident about the claim of the options presented having “some support or warranty”, when they recommend:
Volla: Available only in European Union, the EFTA countries and the United Kingdom.
Warranty says:
New devices and their components which show a defect due to manufacturing and/or material faults within 24 months of purchase shall be replaced or repaired by Volla Systeme GmbH free of charge at its own discretion with a state-of-the-art device. For wearing parts (e.g. batteries, keyboards, housings), this durability guarantee shall apply for six months from the date of purchase.
Meanwhile pixel: The Pixel 10 series is available to buy in these 33 countries
Wider availability (They serve outside Europe). The warranty is also for 1 years, with extended warranty of 2 years and Pixel Care + available that extends it further and covers everything. More than the 6 months Volla promise for non-manufacturing defects. Plus they have mail in repair, plus more authorised repair centres than Volla.
I am not sure I see the point at all.
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until you realize pixels also don’t serve in many other countries even that are in europe including but not limited to Cyprus, Ukraine, Uzbekista, Latin America, African countries, Southeast Asia, Middle East and Central Asia, this is not a valid argument to use that “Pixels sell in more countries” than it when they might as well be equivalent
you also dismissed the comment om the fact that for better or for worse GrapheneOS remains niche, not everyone let alone your average person bothers with checking forums for solution not to mention the sometimes attitude you would get with thr community in which you’re better off asking at PG than them but still applies that many if hopefully they have a tech savvy person if not they resort to usually repair shops on issues not even an average person would know. (Google’s warranty or support only cover hardware/firmware (unless the firmware is caused by the software) issues, it does not cover software if you have issues with say GrapheneOS hence the problem, with stock os google covers you on both fronts)
I still remember recently someone struggled to figure out why Google Messages had the text so big on the messages but not the UI, I was the one to figure out that it was because of the pinch to zoom. Now Imagine them figuring out the issues with GOS. This is why I’d point straight blank to many people to just get an iPhone unless they insist on Android in which even figuring out to get a pixel let alkne even the fact that putting GrapheneOS is to many foreign, unless it’s my friends and stuff in which I am close enough to educate and help.
again the project does deserve its praises I’ll give them credit where credit is due but they also deserve the scrutiny they need to foster a friendlier community and help clueless/beginner people
The original point was the alternatives Tuta offers have some warranty and support and are available in a wider area, and implied Pixels and GrapheneOS don’t have the same things. I corrected them. Volla also does not cover SE Asia or any other country other than what they say on the website.
I was correcting their point, which is important for readers not willing to put in the effort to fact check them but might unintentionally absorb and repeat them back.
My response followed the flow of: Claim made → I checked the claim and found it to be wrong → Made a correction.
If the initial claim is “wider coverage” what else should a correction be but “more coverage”.
Can you quote where? I did not make any such claim, I am very astonished that you find it so easy to make a false claim.
The rest of the rant is irrelevant and tangential to the discussion, and does not relate to anything I said.
I am not sure what this reply is even about, including the unrelated diatribe on Android or iOS flame war-esque UI discussion. Feel free to create a thread to discuss the opinion on why people should use iOS or how Android UI perplexed you.
on the last one
I am not saying android is hard or iOS is or GrapheneOS is but I think linus who did the review put it perfectly when he said that we as privacy conscious/advocate users dont mind a little side quest pickup if anything goes wrong but for many people that is not even an option and not many are aware of so called ‘forums’, many people would be asking help from he nearby tech savvy, repair shop or google themselves, they wont know to go to the GrapheneOS forum to get answers and if there’s even an answer to their issue (to give the benefit of doubt usually yes, other times no)
Again I am not trying to dismiss Graphene’s efforts but there is clearly still a gap between your average person and Graphene let alone custom roms no matter the argument, and I never said either or both is hard to use or Android vs iOS rah iOS better you are once again taking things out of context like you said that you did not make a claim if so you provide your source of claim where that implies I said Android is hard and iOS is easy
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This is unrelated to anything I said in the thread. Maybe you are confusing this thread with another.
this is related because you imply that with added benefit of GrapheneOS forums means that in order to get support on the software front you need the forums and I am saying that not many people are aware of such things like that when their first instict is not even to go to forums and hope they solve it, more often they wanna offload it to someone who knows what they’re doing (so that would be Google Support, Tech savvy family or friend or Repair shops) and this is speaking from experience even on stock experiences (like stock samsung or iOS or whatever where issues appeared in my experiences would be solved even with simple googling or understanding would resolve the issue but instead they resort to me which goes to sow the level of savviness we are dealing with not mentioning the recent experience I gave)
No, if you read carefully, I said GrapheneOS has the coverage of both Google’s warranty and support with the added benefit of forum. Not:
Can you quote where? I will quote what I said again in hopes that maybe you will finally read it:
This also means you made a false accusation here, as you did not provide a quote where I said or implied this earlier accusation you made:
This sours me from further engaging here, so I hope you will excuse me if I do not grace further insinuations from you with a response. Hope the additional clarification on top helps. I also recommend reading the thread from the beginning with a calm mind. Forum members should try to be exact not just for the benefit of the participants but also the silent majority of readers. This inexactness and hand waving is unsuitable for public discourse, especially over text.