# Which browser do you prefer and why? **URL:** https://discuss.privacyguides.net/t/which-browser-do-you-prefer-and-why/21269 **Category:** Questions **Created:** 2024-10-05T09:57:29Z **Posts:** 107 ## Post 1 by @PrivacyEnthusiast — 2024-10-05T09:57:29Z Im confused about choosing a privacy focused browser for regular use on android. I have Brave, DDG, Firefox and Mullvad on the list. Please, Help me out choosing the right one. --- ## Post 2 by @yes — 2024-10-05T10:08:57Z You should’ve specified which platform you’re looking for. Personally, I use Brave on Android. --- ## Post 3 by @anon73250778 — 2024-10-05T10:12:46Z Monoculture is a cancer and the answer is simple enough: Firefox Mozilla is a trash company but still people need to use it to stem the Chromium tide swallowing the entire web browsable internet whole. If the sites you frequent isnt broken in Firefox, keep using it or its derivatives Mullvad and Tor Browser. * * * Unfortunately there is no decent alternative to Brave on mobile browsers. --- ## Post 4 by @null — 2024-10-05T10:37:52Z I use Cromite for regular use, Vanadium for logins and Tor browser if needed. [https://divestos.org/pages/browsers](https://divestos.org/pages/browsers) --- ## Post 5 by @anon48875053 — 2024-10-05T11:56:44Z Android: Vanadium iOS: Brave Linux: Mullvad and Firefox If you aren’t using GrapheneOS, then stick with Brave. --- ## Post 7 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-05T14:59:55Z Desktop: Firefox with [Brace](https://codeberg.org/divested/brace) & Tor Browser where appropriate Android: Mull & Tor Browser where appropriate Why? Because fuck Chromium and fuck VC shit. --- ## Post 8 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-05T15:04:30Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > spectre-like attacks are on the rise) How do those work with JIT disabled and the timing mitigations of RFP? --- ## Post 11 by @bigdzi — 2024-10-05T18:14:31Z > [@anon73250778](#): > > Mozilla is a trash company, but… Period. No `but's`. It really IS trash company. Period. End of story. > [@anon73250778](#): > > keep using it Using what? Trash? No man, trash is to be thrown out and forgotten, not be used. --- ## Post 12 by @anon83749493 — 2024-10-05T18:27:59Z and use Brave, amirite? --- ## Post 13 by @flarmo — 2024-10-05T18:33:58Z Linux: Firefox + extensions, Mullvad Android: Mull (Primary), Vanadium (Secondary). Used Brave until recently. Removed it to just minimise the number of apps. iOS: Safari & Firefox Focus (w Next DNS) --- ## Post 14 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-05T21:51:36Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > Any specific technical reason or is it just ideology? If it gets anti-trusted and becomes a distinct entity, like _the_ standardized reference browser I’d have zero issue with it. As is it requires an army to maintain that only few can provide and we see others (RIP :trident: ) have entirely given up. --- ## Post 15 by @asanyan — 2024-10-05T22:27:47Z pc: floorp, librewolf, mullvad browser, tor browser. android: mull, torbrowser --- ## Post 16 by @BlackDog — 2024-10-06T00:05:08Z PC: Firefox (with PG tweaks and uBO) Android (Calyx): Mull --- ## Post 17 by @mangomango — 2024-10-06T02:15:59Z desktop : I used to use only Brave for years but since a few months I use Mullvad Browser for general search and Brave for logins. Android : Vanadium. --- ## Post 18 by @xe3 — 2024-10-06T03:15:45Z On _ **Android** _ my (mild) order of preference would probably be: 1. Brave 2. Mull 3. Others For _ **GrapheneOS** _ _specifically_, Vanadium is an option as well which I’d place in the #1 or #2 position above. > **And on desktop...** > > Primary Browser: > > 1. **Firefox + Arkenfox** > 2. Brave > > Purpose Built: > > - **Tor Browser** > - **Mullvad Browser** > > Testing: > > - Firefox Nightly > - Various small dependent derivatives of Firefox > - Chromium and various dependent derivatives --- ## Post 19 by @Showplace8087 — 2024-10-06T04:24:01Z On my phone/tablet: Vanadium for logins, Brave for browsing Laptop/desktop: Mullvad for browsing, Firefox for logins, Brave for a couple of login sites that don’t work in Firefox --- ## Post 20 by @username0990 — 2024-10-06T05:46:08Z > [@anon63378630](#): > > [Brace](https://codeberg.org/divested/brace) [This page](https://codeberg.org/divested/brace#building) doesn’t say how to build brace for Tumbleweed, I think it is done with the same command as for Fedora. --- ## Post 22 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-06T13:37:43Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > Is Tor browser on Android actually recommended? Would it prevent leaks of timezone, screen dimensions, etc.? And since it’s Firefox, it would still suffer from the same issues right? It gets the job done. I see too many people just routing Chrome or Opera or some shit via Orbot, which is waaaaaaay worse. Fenix has no letterboxing so it can’t protect screen/density, but everything else is largely fine. Test it out using TZP: [TZP](https://arkenfox.github.io/TZP/tzp.html) - Firefox 131 with Brace I get one failure - Mull 131 I get two failures - Tor Browser Desktop & Android 13.5.6 I get no failures --- ## Post 23 by @anon21489307 — 2024-10-06T15:41:12Z > [@anon63378630](#): > > If it gets anti-trusted and becomes a distinct entity Is it possible for Chromium, an open source project, to get anti-trusted??? --- ## Post 26 by @anon21489307 — 2024-10-06T15:52:52Z The source is up there available to everyone. So, without Google and there’s no one who would touch the source despite it’s being the most secure browser on earth, due to their ideology with inferior alternatives that’s probably needed to rewrite from scratch, I think just let it be :joy: --- ## Post 27 by @rottenwheel — 2024-10-07T01:55:01Z What about LibreWolf on Linux? --- ## Post 28 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-07T01:57:22Z Librewolf is falling apart: [Compared librewolf.cfg with arkenfox user.js · Issue #1809 · arkenfox/user.js · GitHub](https://github.com/arkenfox/user.js/issues/1809#issuecomment-1949635343) --- ## Post 29 by @FlipSid — 2024-10-07T07:33:45Z I migrated to hardend Brave, from Vanadium, because of the content filtering and ability to save bookmarks. And because I wanted to use something different. I use it for everything. For BBB I need MS Edge, but ill try to run it on Vanadium. Im on GrapheneOS :slight_smile: --- ## Post 30 by @ph00lt0 — 2024-10-07T08:38:13Z I use brave, for me the forgetful browsing feature is the most convenient way to role a browser. It forgets anything besides on the websites i whitelisted. That is just symphony. For research stuff I use mullvad browser alongside it. --- ## Post 31 by @Sprout3425 — 2024-10-07T09:07:53Z I just use Brave for everything Android and Windows. I can not be bothered to trouble myself with Arkenfox any longer. I always forgot what the niche use cases of Mullvad and Tor are so I need to re-read the knowledge base for like the tenth time now which I also can not be bothered to do at the moment, so I just use incognito mode on Brave. Also Firefox is kind of slow on me for some reason, especially with Arkenfox enabled. --- ## Post 32 by @bigdzi — 2024-10-07T11:17:40Z > [@ph00lt0](#): > > I use brave, for me the forgetful browsing feature is the most convenient way to role a browser. It forgets anything besides on the websites i whitelisted. That is just symphony. For research stuff I use mullvad browser alongside it. And thats exactly how things should be… well done @ph00lt0 > [@archerallstars](#): > > Is it possible for Chromium, an open source project, to get anti-trusted??? Very much so @archerallstars. There is not so many truly OSS project I personally trust. --- ## Post 33 by @water — 2024-10-07T15:02:46Z Personally, I use Firefox on all devices that I have; on mobile, it’s either Firefox Focus or DDG. I do not use my phone long enough to need anything more than that, it’s only there to look for some links that my friends have sent me or me looking up something on the fly. I believe it’s good enough for my casual usage on phone. On my computer (all three OS): I use firefox with uBO for mast part, it just works almost everywhere. --- ## Post 34 by @TartlyUnderwear — 2024-10-07T16:16:24Z If you are the average person, Tor won’t be necessary especially with the reduced speeds. Mullvad Browser is geared more towards average person threat models without sacrificing browsing speed. Also note that you can use any VPN with it. When you use Mullvad Browser, you are essentially switching to a two-browser model. For example, Brave/Firefox for logging into sites and Mullvad for browsing sites that don’t require login and you maintain anonymity. It can take some time getting used to switching back and forth between browsers during browsing sessions. --- ## Post 35 by @Average_Joe — 2024-10-07T16:28:06Z What do people think about Beta versions of web browsers. These are the examples I’m referring to: > **[Try New Features with Google Chrome Beta](https://www.google.com/chrome/beta/)** > > Feeling adventurous? Preview upcoming Google Chrome features before they’re released and give us feedback to make Chrome a better browser. > **[Firefox Developer Edition](https://www.firefox.com/en-US/channel/desktop/developer/?redirect_source=mozilla-org)** > > Firefox Developer Edition is the blazing fast browser that offers cutting edge developer tools and latest features like CSS Grid support and framework debugging > **[Brave Browser Beta Download | Brave](https://brave.com/download-beta/)** > > Brave Beta is an early preview for new versions of Brave that showcases the newest advances that we're bringing to your browser. It automatically sends us crash reports when things go wrong. Downloads of this version of Brave are available here. There are even “Nightly Builds” available. **I ask this question because I’ve never seen it addressed anywhere in PrivacyGuides history.** **I know Beta Apps aren’t complete and maybe insecure but then again, Google uses beta versions of Linux for their servers.** I’m just worried that Beta web browsers are sending back telemetry which may be for the noble purpose of fixing bugs but this may also mean that Beta web browsers are sending back personal user data as well. --- ## Post 36 by @anon21489307 — 2024-10-07T21:12:42Z > [@bigdzi](#): > > Very much so @anon21489307. There is not so many truly OSS project I personally trust. How? If that’s possible, is that mean someone could get filed from using FOSS? In this context, why is Chromium not a true FOSS? Is there anything wrong in the source’s license that could convince you to believe that’s the case? --- ## Post 37 by @bigdzi — 2024-10-07T21:49:26Z @anon21489307 I dont want to start wars here, so will not go into details here. --- ## Post 38 by @TartlyUnderwear — 2024-10-07T22:11:57Z There’s no point in beta browsers unless you’re a developer and interested in doing some testing. Also not sure why you included Chrome as an option. Just because it’s beta doesn’t make it any less privacy invasive. The same criteria for browsers applies to the beta versions, and according to PG Chrome does not meet that criteria. --- ## Post 39 by @xe3 — 2024-10-07T23:01:21Z > [@Average_Joe](#): > > What do people think about Beta versions of web browsers. > There are even “Nightly Builds” I tend to, opt-in to beta testing most of the time. But not with web browsers. With browsers I stick to the stable branch as a daily driver and use nightly for testing and to keep up with what features and fixes are being working on, what is changing, and so on. One reason you may not want to run beta or nightly browsers (if you use a browser that takes fingerprinting seriously) is you are placing yourself into a much smaller group of users, with a probably somewhat unique fingerprint. > I’m just worried that Beta web browsers are sending back telemetry Personally, I often opt to enable telemetry or at least manually provide feedback/bug reports with Beta or Alpha/Nightly stuff (if it is open source and I trust the developer). Its a small thing, but I like to at least try to contribute to the development and improvement of the software that I like (and receiving real world feedback is part of the purpose of open beta testing) Telemetry mostly became a bad word because shitty big tech companies abused it, but it isn’t in and of itself bad. Often, as you noted, it is for a useful and noble purpose (making software better). I’m trying to re-calibrate my own mindset about Telemetry to reflect the fact that I have reasonable trust in most of the software I use, and have a shared interest in wanting to improve that software. --- ## Post 40 by @mangomango — 2024-10-08T02:52:49Z Same, nice to know I am not alone ! ^^ --- ## Post 41 by @anon73250778 — 2024-10-08T12:00:03Z If you are wondering why UX of FOSS apps suck… consider sending telemetry instead --- ## Post 42 by @anon48875053 — 2024-10-08T15:00:32Z No point in using it. --- ## Post 43 by @rottenwheel — 2024-10-08T21:14:27Z Works on my machine^™. --- ## Post 44 by @mangomango — 2024-10-08T23:06:58Z In fact, for a very casual and general browsing, I have found Lockdown Respondus Browser to be very good. Content blocking and resistance to fingerprinting are clearly above-average. In addition, good > **Privacy policy :** > > - **Collect as little personal information as possible.** We aim to collect only the personal information needed to ensure we can offer excellent products and services. > - **Be transparent with the information we collect.** We want our users to understand what information Respondus collects and what we plan to do with it. > - **Limit the sharing of customer information.** We limit the sharing of customer information and provide our users with visibility into the few situations where personal information may be shared or disclosed to organizations outside of Respondus. > - **Build and maintain safe products & services.** We work hard to provide users with a safe and trustworthy place to interact with Respondus, our services, and our partners. Security is always a top priority when it comes to gathering, storing and using personal data. > - **Allow users to easily contact us.** Our company is built upon trust and relationships with users. Whether your concern is related to privacy, security, or a service we offer, a real person from our staff will respond to you in a prompt manner Just joking, don’t use it --- ## Post 45 by @PF01 — 2024-10-09T19:28:18Z For Android I use [Quetta browser](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=net.quetta.browser). It works smooth, supports browser extensions (such as ublock) and has some privacy options. It’s a fairly new browser that gets updated on a regular basis. For Windows I use both [Iridium browser](https://iridiumbrowser.de/) and Mullvad. --- ## Post 46 by @anon48875053 — 2024-10-09T19:31:53Z > [@YouTube's war against its users](https://discuss.privacyguides.net/t/youtubes-war-against-its-users/21164/23): > > @alt43 Quetta 1.2.5 (latest available) is based on Chromium 124.0.6367.179 from May 13th 2024 and is highly insecure, also proprietary as mentioned above. Use a real browser please. Chromium version can be determined by downloading and extracting the APK and running: strings lib/arm\*/lib\*chrome\*.so | grep "Chrome/1" edit: 2024/10/09: I just checked 1.2.7 and it is the same 124.0.6367.179 @anonfox Kiwi is on 124.0.6327.3, so this very well may be true. Whatsup with people and these garbage browsers? Never saw them before, and now they are being mentioned multiple times. --- ## Post 47 by @Astatine — 2024-10-09T22:40:04Z I use the following in order of preference and frequent use: > **Desktop (Windows)** > > **Brave:** I don’t need to block elements such as newsletter notices or annoyances, as those on Firefox using uBlock Origin do, since I really don’t care and it doesn’t bother me. > > **Firefox** w/ Arkenfox: I use this as a fallback, or for logging into sites like this forum. Yes, I could do that on Brave, but I want to keep what I do on both browsers separate. A key difference is that I use uBlock Origin Lite, rather than uBlock Origin, although there seems to be [some](https://discuss.privacyguides.net/t/ublock-origin-lite-maker-ends-firefox-store-support/21204) issues with the former currently. > > **Mullvad:** For generic searches, reading information, researching for information so I can respond to queries like [this](https://discuss.privacyguides.net/t/doctor-refuses-to-see-me-because-i-expressed-reservations-about-having-to-share-my-social-security-number-what-should-i-do/21332), and the like. > > **Tor Browser:** I somewhat use it for the same purposes as Mullvad, especially for anonymity. > **Android (Plastic Premium Galaxy)** > > **Tor Browser:** Since I don’t use my Galaxy frequently, as I’m almost always on desktop, I mainly use Tor browser unless I need to sign in. Thus, I use Brave as a secondary browser. > > **Brave:** I use this very similarly to desktop, except I don’t add exceptions since I can’t. (It’s either clear everything or manually clear what you want.) I simply just clear everything and deal with the inconvenience. > > Differently to desktop, I use this also when I’m impatient with Tor Browser speeds, such as using Invidious on a .onion site, I just use it on Brave. > > **Mulch:** I use this for sites I can safely stay logged into, like Cryptee. --- ## Post 48 by @water — 2024-10-09T23:34:38Z Anyone who mentions “Privacy” and “A browser with AI adblocking” should go straight to jail. Also, curiosity got the better of me and I looked up this “company” which is less 10 months old, and it’s sufficiently hard to find any information for them. Totally not a shady company and an attempt to lure people into installing it. --- ## Post 49 by @8pen-s8urce — 2024-10-09T23:45:09Z > [@Average_Joe](#): > > What do people think about Beta versions of web browsers. I hope this post helps you and others form an informed opinion on this subject. This post is about non-stable versions of Brave, Firefox and Chrome browsers. If you aren’t interested on that, please skip this wall of text. TLDR: Beta, Alpha, Nightly, Testfligh, Dev, Canary and other non stable versions of browsers are generally not recommended due to less security guarantees with them and also due to usual extra telemetry enabled in non stable browser versions. You can sometimes disable the extra telemetry of non stable browser versions completely or partially, but even then such browsers don’t provide any significant advantage compared to stable browser versions. TLDR 2.0: Use normal browser versions if you want the most privacy and security. **Brave browser:** Brave Software Inc. (the company behind the Brave browser) addresses the privacy and security implications of its beta and nightly versions in the following documents (the Dev version is also mentioned, but I think that’s an old version of Brave that doesn’t exist anymore, at least I can’t find any link to download it anywhere): The relevant sections of Brave’s privacy policy: • [Browser Privacy Policy | Brave](https://brave.com/privacy/browser/#dev); • [Browser Privacy Policy | Brave](https://brave.com/privacy/browser/#dev-detail). > **[Release Channel Descriptions](https://github.com/brave/brave-browser/wiki/Release-Channel-Descriptions)** > > Brave browser for Android, iOS, Linux, macOS, Windows. - brave/brave-browser The Beta and Nightly versions come with more analytics enabled by default, and, from my interpretation of Brave’s privacy policy, you can _partially_ opt-out of them if you want to (read the privacy policy for more details, the parts that address this are faster to read than this post, and explain this better). Also, Brave Software Inc. doesn’t maintain any promises about Brave’s privacy and security when you use the Beta or Nightly versions (better described by Brave on the GitHub link I sent above, really fast to read). **Firefox:** Mozilla, the organisation behind Firefox, claims the following in its [Firefox Privacy Notice — Mozilla](https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/privacy/firefox/#pre-release) (I copied the only relevant part): > Mozilla’s pre-release versions of Firefox (which are distributed through channels such as Nightly, Beta, Developer Edition and TestFlight) are development platforms frequently updated with experimental features and studies. In addition to the data collection described in this Privacy Notice, these versions by default may send certain types of web activity and crash data to Mozilla and in some cases to our partners. Any data collection or sharing adheres to our Firefox data collection policy and we will always be transparent and provide you with controls. For more details of what kinds of analytics can be enabled by default when using Firefox Nightly, Beta, Developer Edition or TestFlight, look at the “Eligibility for Default on Data Collection” section of the [Data Collection - MozillaWiki](https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/Data_Collection) entry, more specifically at the Category 3 “Stored Content and Communications”. I wanted to find some information more specific to what extra data is collected by Mozilla and how to opt-out of that exact data collection when using Firefox Nightly, Beta, Developer Edition or TestFlight, but I didn’t find any more information about that provided by Mozilla. In my opinion, they should be more clear and specific about this, or am I missing something? **Google Chrome:** Last and worst privacy wise, Google Chrome has some official documentation about its release channels: > **[What are Chrome release channels?  |  Web Platform  | ...](https://developer.chrome.com/docs/web-platform/chrome-release-channels?hl=en)** > > Learn how Chrome uses the Canary, Dev, Beta, and Stable release channels to test new features, and roll out updates. [https://www.chromium.org/getting-involved/dev-channel/](https://www.chromium.org/getting-involved/dev-channel/) As expected, Google isn’t very specific about what data is collected when using other release channels of Chrome compared to the stable release channel, neither about how (or if) you can opt-out of that data collection. The best I found was this (first link): > By default, Canary reports crashes and usage statistics to Google (you can deactivate this feature). And this (first link, also applies to stable Chrome): > Metrics > If the setting to help improve Chrome’s features and performance is enabled (chrome://settings/syncSetup?search=improve) then Chrome can automatically monitor and send anonymous metrics to the Chrome backend—such as memory usage, page load times, or the usage of a browser feature. Chrome uses metrics to check performance, stability, and for unexpected behavior. This mechanism can also be used with field trials to compare metrics for users who have a new feature activated, and the control group of those who don’t. That way, if a problem occurs, Chrome engineers can turn off the new feature while they’re working on a fix. This sound like Chrome metrics, independent of the release channel. **Warning:** All the information I shared with you so far is based in documentation and resources from first-party sources, which means I am trusting Brave’s official resources about the Brave browser, Mozzila’s about Firefox and Google’s about Google Chrome. Terms of Service and Privacy Policies carry legal importance, so I find it unlikely that any of this product’s Terms or Service and Privacy Policies are lying directly to their (few) readers, such lies are more likely to occur in marketing materials (this is general advice, not specific to Google, Brave Software Inc. or Mozilla). **Third-party reviews:** For a third-party review of some privacy and security protections and features that come enabled by default with different beta/nightly browsers (and stable versions of those browsers too), the following website is the best resource I know of: > **[Which browsers are best for privacy?](https://privacytests.org/nightly)** > > An open-source privacy audit of popular web browsers. > **[Which browsers are best for privacy?](https://privacytests.org/nightly-private)** > > An open-source privacy audit of popular web browsers. PS.: The maintainer of [privacytests.org](http://privacytests.org) works for Brave, although he created and published the website many months before starting to work for Brave and, in my opinion, he is very transparent about this in the website’s about page. Source: [Open-source tests of web browser privacy](https://privacytests.org/about) **Congratulations! :partying_face:** If you read and understood all of this, have a nice day and share feedback about this post, whether positive or negative (specially negative, it’s more urgent to improve wrong/misleading information/advice than to receive an heart reaction emoji, although those are also appreciated). --- ## Post 50 by @PurpleDime — 2024-10-10T05:14:43Z lol Why did you specifically need Mullvad to read the post I made on this forum? --- ## Post 51 by @Astatine — 2024-10-10T08:33:19Z Take a look again. --- ## Post 52 by @jcprivacyguides — 2024-10-10T09:05:25Z Mull over Firefox Focus? --- ## Post 54 by @8pen-s8urce — 2024-10-10T13:41:34Z Mull is also recommended by Privacy Guides in the [Mobile browsers page](https://www.privacyguides.org/en/mobile-browsers/#mull), not Firefox Focus or Firefox for Android. In case you end up using Mull, I recommend reading the above link so that you use Mull in the best possible way, or at least so you are better informed about Mull, its advantages, weaknesses and other things to take into account. --- ## Post 55 by @jcprivacyguides — 2024-10-10T17:12:27Z Yet [Techlore](https://www.techlore.tech/resources) recommends Firefox Focus over Mull, and [privacytests.org’s open-source tests](https://privacytests.org/android.html) shows that Focus has more green ticks overall. --- ## Post 56 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-10T17:36:08Z > [@jcprivacyguides](#): > > Firefox Focus over Mull If you’re going to use Focus, you should instead use Klar. Please also be aware that Mull does not have any proprietary code, while both Firefox & Focus/Klar do. > [@jcprivacyguides](#): > > has more green ticks overall. because it clears on close. Set “clear on quit” in Mull and you’ll get all the same green ticks. --- ## Post 59 by @8pen-s8urce — 2024-10-10T18:04:02Z Just some notes: If you read both Mull and Firefox/Focus recommendation descriptions, you will notice that it gives Mull credit for having better security and privacy defaults than Firefox and Firefox Focus on Android, as well as hardening that can’t be achieved when using normal Firefox or Firefox Focus on mobile. Firefox/Focus description: > Firefox doesn’t have the best defaults, reserving maximum privacy & security through hardening the browser. (Limited on mobile) An attractive reason to use Firefox is it’s an alternative to the Chromium monopoly. Mull description: > Mull is the closest thing to a pre-hardened Firefox on Android. It brings many features from the Tor Uplift Project, the arkenfox project, & more! It is recommended to install ‘uBlock Origin’. As to the favorite check mark being attributed to Firefox/Focus instead of Mull, I disagree with Techlore in that regard and I don’t have any way to defend that choice. --- ## Post 60 by @8pen-s8urce — 2024-10-10T18:17:11Z > [@jcprivacyguides](#): > > [privacytests.org’s open-source tests](https://privacytests.org/android.html) shows that Focus has more green ticks overall. As for [PrivacyTests.org](http://PrivacyTests.org), it only tests browsers under their default configurations, that is a limitation that people should keep in mind when checking that website’s test results. Quoting form the website’s [about page](https://privacytests.org/about) (emphasis mine in the second paragraph): > **How the tests work** > > To understand and compare the privacy characteristics of popular web browsers, each browser is subjected to the same suite of rigorous automated tests. Each privacy test examines whether the browser, **on default settings** , protects against a specific kind of data leak. --- ## Post 61 by @Astatine — 2024-10-10T20:49:27Z Personally, I would **never** recommend Techlore as a resource for anyone, but I do admit it did help start my privacy journey. I would use Mull over Firefox Focus, since you can install uBlock Origin _and_ it’s hardened. Firefox Focus has literally no ad blocking which is quite an important feature. --- ## Post 62 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-10T20:50:33Z > [@Astatine](#): > > Firefox Focus has literally no content blocking. It does. --- ## Post 63 by @Astatine — 2024-10-10T20:51:22Z I clarified, thanks for pointing that out. --- ## Post 64 by @Dkama — 2024-10-10T22:24:41Z > [@anon48875053](#): > > Your source is a YouTuber that doesn’t recommend GrapheneOS, but recommends LineageOS: In his defense, the GrapheneOS people threw a hissy fit and asked him not to mention their name. I think Henry even mentioned in some video that he would recommend “that phone OS” if they allowed it. I love the project, but we could live with a little less drama (even though I admit it improved a lot lately). --- ## Post 65 by @anon46412288 — 2024-10-11T08:57:46Z On the desktop - only Firefox (cause Mv2 uBO) On Android - Firefox (cause extensions), or Mull --- ## Post 66 by @jcprivacyguides — 2024-10-11T09:26:31Z Many thanks all for your insightful advice. For privacy newbies like myself, it can take some time to find good, trustworthy advice and then grow to understand the nuances. For example, it was not obvious to me and the uninitiated that many of the green ticks in the browser-test is simply a result of the browser clearing data upon close. A clear note explaining a setting on the browser can be changed to achieve the same level of privacy would help ignorant people like myself make better decisions. I never rely on default settings. The first thing I do when I download an app is check if I can improve its privacy. I gather from everyone’s responses that when the available settings are changed for optimal privacy, Mull is more effective than Firefox Focus is? --- ## Post 67 by @sha123 — 2024-10-11T09:44:51Z Thx for sharing. Pretty unfortunate for LW users, who had a decently configured browser while fxbrit was around. --- ## Post 68 by @bigdzi — 2024-10-11T09:46:56Z For everyday use: Safari Developer Preview with 99% of test/beta functions disabled. For sensitive browsing (banks, shops, alike) :: practically every browser thats able to run behind packet-stopper. --- ## Post 69 by @8pen-s8urce — 2024-10-11T11:49:59Z > [@jcprivacyguides](#): > > I gather from everyone’s responses that when the available settings are changed for optimal privacy, Mull is more effective than Firefox Focus is? Yes. --- ## Post 70 by @batman — 2024-10-11T11:58:27Z Desktop: Mullvad Browser, Brave and Tor Browser Android: Mull,Brave and Tor Browser --- ## Post 71 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-11T17:21:30Z > [@jcprivacyguides](#): > > available settings are changed for optimal Optimal settings for many browsers are even noted here: [https://divestos.org/pages/browsers#tuning](https://divestos.org/pages/browsers#tuning) --- ## Post 72 by @gregandcin — 2024-10-11T17:47:08Z Any reason you recommend adding lists to uBO when PG tends to say not to? (I add lists, to be clear) --- ## Post 73 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-11T17:51:15Z @gregandcin because fuck those companies, give them as little as possible strong fp mitigations + strong blocker is the way --- ## Post 74 by @FlipSid — 2024-10-11T21:06:28Z Little OT but I sure enjoy reading your posts :sweat_smile: --- ## Post 75 by @privacy3765 — 2024-10-12T13:11:14Z Thx for this interesting post!! I think I will go for this setup based on gecko (I don’t want to use chromium) : Work desktop (Windows) : - Firefox for work - Librewolf (updated by windows store) for personal use Home desktop (Fedora) : - Librewolf. Maybe braced Firefox would be better? Android (GrapheneOS) : - Vanadium (and not Mull because it hasn’t dark mode :cry:) --- ## Post 76 by @batman — 2024-10-12T13:42:25Z go to Extensions and add Dark Reader --- ## Post 77 by @privacy3765 — 2024-10-12T13:47:48Z Yes, I would like to. But I see that on divestOS site : " \* Dark Reader is known to be incompatible with the Mull changes and will cause significant breakage/slowdowns. - Dark mode for websites is disabled due to resist fingerprinting. Please do not disable RFP." --- ## Post 79 by @anon48875053 — 2024-10-12T15:11:23Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > Unless of course you want persistent cookies and history, since Mullvad is always on incognito mode (deletes history, cookies, site settings, etc. on quit). Not for long: [Draft Feature Proposal Document for 'Persistent Mode' (#300) · Issues · The Tor Project / Applications / Mullvad Browser · GitLab](https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/applications/mullvad-browser/-/issues/300) --- ## Post 81 by @privacy3765 — 2024-10-12T16:38:04Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > I think you meant arkenfox js Firefox, right? What’s braced Firefox? I don’t how to use it but here’s the [link](https://codeberg.org/divested/brace) --- ## Post 83 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-12T17:39:29Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > Yeah, it’s the same thing fwiw there are a handful of changes marked with //BRACE and //MULL like disabling JIT it matches the same as what is in Mull --- ## Post 85 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-12T19:10:35Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > Mullvad and Arkenfox seems to be to make every user look exactly the same Tor/Mullvad Browser, yes. Arkenfox, no, it is just a template. Mull, yes, with other Mull users of similar enough devices. Brace, yes, with other Brace users. Brace doesn’t intend to be 1:1 with arkenfox, again arkenfox is intended as a template and meant to be customized as appropriate. Brace is meant to provide some level of desktop equivalent of DivestOS/Mull but on Fedora & Arch. Brace adds its Firefox changes to the system path so the user path will still take precedence. But users shouldn’t be using anything extra. You should still be using Tor/Mullvad browser in addition to braced Firefox/Mull where appropriate. As far as numbers game: - Brace probably has \<100 users. - Mull on the other hand has 10s of thousands. Hard to measure without any telemetry, but here are download counts solely from [F-Droid.org](http://F-Droid.org), no mirrors or [DivestOS.org](http://DivestOS.org). ![13215-us.spotco.fennec_dos](//forum-uploads.privacyguidesusercontent.com/original/2X/c/c80f14e696bb5d4f86eb5d239090b365e42d14f6.png) (other F-Droid app stats are here [https://divestos.org/pages/fdroid\_stats](https://divestos.org/pages/fdroid_stats)) Last edit: While I use/prefer Braced Firefox, I’m not necessarily recommending others do. Mullvad Browser is a really good choice for those who want privacy hardened Firefox. I’d likely drop Mull if they brought it to Android and it was FOSS. --- ## Post 87 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-12T19:30:20Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > Are these unique downloads or just a aggregate count of hits on server? Those are apk downloads from [F-Droid.org](http://F-Droid.org), each peak largely corresponds with a new release. And again that is only from [F-Droid.org](http://F-Droid.org), not their other twenty mirror servers or the seven [DivestOS.org](http://DivestOS.org) repo mirrors. I don’t see why users would uninstall/reinstall repeatedly. > [@Anon47486929](#): > > make default brace preferences I have no intent changing them from what they are currently, you can even see my reasons why next to the changes. They’ve been stable across Brace/Mull for a few years now. Disabling the JIT is extremely valuable and even for Tor/Mullvad users I recommend using Safer at the very minimum. Like Brace & Mull are probably the only Firefox variants currently enabling Kyber support, that is fingerprintable, but it is also beneficial enough to justify the change. Ultimately Brace & Mull do not intend to be a replacement for complete solutions like Tor Browser. --- ## Post 89 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-12T19:35:32Z > [@Anon47486929](#): > > more chromium Brace does also provide changes to Chromium here fwiw: [Making sure you're not a bot!](https://codeberg.org/divested/brace/src/branch/master/brace/etc/chromium/policies/managed/brace.json) --- ## Post 91 by @xe3 — 2024-10-12T21:15:06Z > [@anon63378630](#): > > Brace adds its Firefox changes to the system path so the user path will still take precedence. But users shouldn’t be using anything extra. Could you break this down a little bit more. I was looking at brace the other day, trying to understand the difference between: 1. ~/firefox/distribution/policies.json 2. ~/firefox/browser/defaults/preferences/\*.js --- ## Post 92 by @JohnDose — 2024-10-13T08:45:00Z Desktop: Mullvad browser, nothing else unless the site breaks with FireFox. Android: unfortunately, Brave. Can’t find a better one. But I seriously don’t expect much from android browsers, since all phones are basically horrible for privacy. iOS: Safari --- ## Post 93 by @anon41112412 — 2024-10-13T10:00:55Z Brave as this just covers most of my needs. Chrome for business side of things. --- ## Post 94 by @Average_Joe — 2024-10-14T10:13:33Z > [@TartlyUnderwear](#): > > There’s no point in beta browsers unless you’re a developer and interested in doing some testing. Also not sure why you included Chrome as an option. Just because it’s beta doesn’t make it any less privacy invasive. The same criteria for browsers applies to the beta versions, and according to PG Chrome does not meet that criteria. > [@anon73250778](#): > > Monoculture is a cancer and the answer is simple enough: Firefox > > Mozilla is a trash company but still people need to use it to stem the Chromium tide swallowing the entire web browsable internet whole. > > If the sites you frequent isnt broken in Firefox, keep using it or its derivatives Mullvad and Tor Browser. > > Unfortunately there is no decent alternative to Brave on mobile browsers. I appreciate your reply! It’d be great if you could mention the browsers you use since Firefox and Chrome are the only players in town at this point. I was looking at a browser that is built from the bottom up and it’s only being released in 2025 and that doesn’t even include a Windows release… **One BIG thing nobody has mentioned:** Google itself uses beta versions of Linux for its OWN servers. This is where I got the idea of beta versions of web browsers being more secure. --- ## Post 95 by @anon48875053 — 2024-10-14T10:56:38Z > [@Average_Joe](#): > > Google itself uses beta versions of Linux for its OWN servers. Google has multiple teams of security experts that are working full time. Regular users don’t have that. --- ## Post 96 by @anon73250778 — 2024-10-14T11:36:27Z I use Mullvad for general browsing. I use Firefox without extensions for sites that I logon with. One profile for each website. I use Brave for whatever sites that are broken in Mullvad. * * * For mobile I go by Vanadium for logged in sites and Brave for general browsing. Also I will look into Mull because @anon63378630 is an interesting guy and I appreciate his work. --- ## Post 97 by @Average_Joe — 2024-10-14T19:56:14Z > [@anon73250778](#): > > Monoculture is a cancer and the answer is simple enough: Firefox > > Mozilla is a trash company but still people need to use it to stem the Chromium tide swallowing the entire web browsable internet whole. > > If the sites you frequent isnt broken in Firefox, keep using it or its derivatives Mullvad and Tor Browser. > > Unfortunately there is no decent alternative to Brave on mobile browsers. I appreciate your reply! It’d be great if you could mention the browsers you use since Firefox and Chrome are the only two options I can see, other than of course the Chromium forks and Firefox forks. This probably deserves another thread, but is this still the most reliable source? **Does PrivacyGuides recommend this:** **[Comparison of Web Browsers](https://eylenburg.github.io/browser_comparison.htm)** --- ## Post 98 by @certainty — 2024-10-14T20:03:12Z > [@anon63378630](#): > > Tor/Mullvad Browser, yes. Aren’t the users again divided among security levels (Standard, safer and safest)? > [@anon63378630](#): > > I don’t see why users would uninstall/reinstall repeatedly. May be due to firefox sync issues. --- ## Post 99 by @anon48875053 — 2024-10-17T12:42:40Z > [@anon73250778](#): > > Also I will look into Mull because @SkewedZeppelin is an interesting guy and I appreciate his work. > **[GrapheneOS (@GrapheneOS@grapheneos.social)](https://grapheneos.social/@GrapheneOS/113322752105905673)** > > @Rhababerbarbar@tux.social Firefox has no sandbox whatsoever on Android, only the standard Android app sandbox around it as a whole. On desktop, it has a proper content sandbox, but it's weaker than Chromium and doesn't have complete site isolation... --- ## Post 100 by @anon63378630 — 2024-10-17T17:01:39Z > being provided as a simple boolean toggle for process services by the OS I’d just like to clarify setting this is far from simple, the services need to be explicitly developed with it in mind, and Mozilla did not do that from the start. It is still absolutely bullshit that Mozilla has not cared to push forward Fission or isolatedProcess on Android for _six years_ now. --- ## Post 101 by @securitybrahh — 2024-10-18T05:10:43Z cromite (its multi platform rn), becaue: 1. chromium based. 2. indie 3. Independently maintained chromium based browser, better than brave? ungoogled chromium ain’t multi platform, edge can’t run on ARM linux. --- ## Post 102 by @sha123 — 2024-10-18T15:32:09Z Yes, programs have to be designed with sandboxing in mind. It’s amazing that Android already had isolatedProcess for web content in Android 4.1. (2012!) and ridiculous that Mozilla didn’t get it done to develop a proper sandbox on by far the most used OS in the world for 12 years. --- ## Post 103 by @Billiam — 2024-10-25T14:04:12Z Desktop (Fedora): Mullvad for general ephemeral browsing. Firefox w/ uBo and Brave divide the rest of the workload, depending on what I’m logging into at the time. Mobile (GrapheneOS): Brave for forgetful browsing and per-site exceptions for logins Occasionally I play with Mull or Vanadium, but they are not daily drivers. --- ## Post 106 by @certainty — 2024-10-26T07:08:43Z Desktop: Firefox, Brave and Mullvad. Mobile: Brave and Mull. Also installed cromite and mulch to check if there’s anything new in them. --- ## Post 107 by @anon85289728 — 2024-10-26T12:05:26Z Desktop: Brave and Librewolf Mobile: Vanadium combined with AdGuard Android