# Orbot + VPN useful? **URL:** https://discuss.privacyguides.net/t/orbot-vpn-useful/19090 **Category:** Questions **Created:** 2024-06-24T15:14:47Z **Posts:** 12 ## Post 1 by @Pragmatic — 2024-06-24T15:14:48Z Hi, there, I use 100% of the time a VPN with Kill switch and I would like to know if it is useful according to you to use Orbot + a VPN on phone to reinforce even more its “anonymity”? Orbot recommends use on messaging and social networks, Signal, Whatsapp, Discord etc.. What do you think? --- ## Post 2 by @deadorbit — 2024-06-24T16:42:23Z Combining a VPN and Tor is counterintuitive and no longer recommended. --- ## Post 3 by @anon39816623 — 2024-06-24T17:01:35Z [https://youtu.be/vo22D-dUeCA?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/vo22D-dUeCA?feature=shared) --- ## Post 4 by @Pragmatic — 2024-06-24T17:13:07Z What I really want to know is if Orbot + Tor are useful together? And if so, how do I configure Orbot with a VPN and make sure it works? --- ## Post 5 by @anon21666177 — 2024-06-24T18:22:28Z It’s not useful since Tor has bridges which are designed to hide the fact that you use Tor from your ISP. --- ## Post 6 by @Gedsh — 2024-06-24T20:17:55Z Most types of Tor bridges are identifiable by a unique fingerprint. If you don’t believe me, read the comments of the creator of the obfs4 protocol. [obfs4/internal at master · Yawning/obfs4 · GitHub](https://github.com/Yawning/obfs4/tree/master/internal) There is one exception - WebTunnel bridges based on HTTPT. But they are fairly new, and it takes time to test them properly. [https://www.usenix.org/conference/foci20/presentation/frolov](https://www.usenix.org/conference/foci20/presentation/frolov) So if you need to hide the fact that you are using Tor, using Tor over a VPN is a good idea. --- ## Post 7 by @anon21666177 — 2024-06-24T23:38:58Z The link you sent is an obs4 developer ranting about obs4. Tor also provides meek-azure and snowflake in addition to webtunnel. --- ## Post 8 by @deadorbit — 2024-06-24T23:52:54Z > [@deadorbit](#): > > Combining a VPN and Tor is counterintuitive and no longer recommended. As I said before, Combining a VPN and Tor is counterintuitive and no longer recommended. --- ## Post 9 by @xe3 — 2024-06-25T01:34:44Z _I don’t have experience with Tor on Android, so the below is just general commentary on Tor+VPN, not Android/Orbot specific._ > [@deadorbit](#): > > Combining a VPN and Tor is counterintuitive and no longer recommended. My recollection is that the Tor Project doesn’t _recommend_ using a VPN, but they also don’t categorically _recommend against_ using `VPN --> Tor` I’m not an expert, but I personally usually use VPN then Tor, I haven’t (yet) heard a compelling broadly applicable reason not to. Do you have clear reasons why you think it is a bad idea? I don’t see a problem with `[You] --> [VPN] --> [Tor] --> [Web]` > **I *DO* see risks and problems with (click me)** > > Don’t do this: `[You] --> [Tor] --> [VPN] --> [Web]` Further reading on the topic for anyone interested in digging deeper: 1. [Can I use Tor with a VPN? (Tor FAQ)](https://support.torproject.org/#faq_faq-5) 2. [Tor+VPN (Tor Wiki)](https://gitlab.torproject.org/legacy/trac/-/wikis/doc/TorPlusVPN) 3. [Whonix: connecting to a VPN before Tor](https://www.whonix.org/wiki/Tunnels/Connecting_to_a_VPN_before_Tor) --- ## Post 10 by @Gedsh — 2024-06-26T09:49:33Z SnowFlake uses the WebRTC protocol in a non-standard way, which also leads to a unique fingerprint. Read this issue for an example [Make Snowflake's DTLS fingerprint more similar to popular WebRTC implementations (#40014) · Issues · The Tor Project / Anti-censorship / Pluggable Transports / Snowflake · GitLab](https://gitlab.torproject.org/tpo/anti-censorship/pluggable-transports/snowflake/-/issues/40014) Meek bridge is slow and very expensive for the Tor project. Moreover, azure has long warned about disabling domain fronting, so it may stop working at any time. --- ## Post 11 by @mardin — 2024-06-26T10:34:33Z Unfortunately there is currently no way to use orbot via vpn on Android. However, it works if you use vpn on your router. --- ## Post 12 by @Pragmatic — 2024-06-26T10:47:57Z If you have the choice of using Orbot in VPN mode or not