# How close to Linux-level privacy can you get with macOS (not signed in) and Little Snitch **URL:** https://discuss.privacyguides.net/t/how-close-to-linux-level-privacy-can-you-get-with-macos-not-signed-in-and-little-snitch/40565 **Category:** General **Created:** 2026-09-09T08:37:28Z **Posts:** 26 ## Post 1 by @not-wittingly — 2026-09-09T08:37:28Z I guess if you’re blocking all the telemetry at the network level it’s got to be quite good? Though I seem to recall a controversy where Apple was using it’s privileged access to skirt around that for first party trackers. --- ## Post 2 by @riseupcoder — 2026-09-09T15:57:29Z Network-level blocking is good, but Big Sur changed the model: NKEs were deprecated and firewalls moved to Network Extension. Apple controls that filtering path, and some first-party traffic can bypass third-party filters. That means LuLu/Little Snitch aren’t a guaranteed “zero Apple telemetry” barrier. --- ## Post 3 by @lewasch — 2026-09-09T19:12:14Z macOS got intentional backdoors that allow remote root privileges, wipes and deletion of applications. --- ## Post 4 by @anon53320198 — 2026-09-09T19:37:43Z Using a DNS based blocker (NextDNS/ControlD) could be an alternative then? I think Apple only has one telemetry domain, and IMO they don’t collect that much telemetry (and even less that is tied to your account/device), but of course that is still much more than Linux (zero, unless enabled) --- ## Post 5 by @anon53320198 — 2026-09-09T19:40:29Z Any source? I would think that they _don’t_ create advanced security features like “Memory Integrity Enforcement” just to implement backdoors that anybody could find. --- ## Post 6 by @lewasch — 2026-09-09T19:47:34Z Read the whole page. There are more backdoors that are suspected to be intentional > **[Apple's Software is Malware - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation](https://www.gnu.org/proprietary/malware-apple.en.html)** --- ## Post 7 by @lewasch — 2026-09-09T19:54:39Z “Anybody could find”. That can be 5 to 15 years and after it’s found they will say it is not intentional --- ## Post 8 by @Shampoo — 2026-09-09T21:32:07Z Seeing as the first “back door” in that list is Apple updating malware signatures in their antivirus to include a specific binary I don’t think that list is helping your argument. --- ## Post 9 by @hydride — 2026-09-10T11:16:17Z > **[Apple security releases - Apple Support](https://support.apple.com/en-us/100100)** > > This document lists security updates for Apple software. Apple basically releases hundreds of “backdoors” every month lol. This kind of suspicion could apply to virtually any software. Sure the possibility exists. For Apple, if they really had backdoors, why wouldn’t they simply provide them to the FBI, Cellebrite, or other law-enforcement and forensic agencies? --- ## Post 10 by @not-wittingly — 2026-09-10T11:23:04Z > [@hydride](#): > > why wouldn’t they simply provide them to the FBI, Cellebrite, or other law-enforcement and forensic agencies? Yeah they work closely with the NSA, do they not? --- ## Post 11 by @hydride — 2026-09-10T11:23:58Z Any proofs > **[FBI stymied by Apple's Lockdown Mode after seizing journalist's iPhone](https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2026/02/fbi-stymied-by-apples-lockdown-mode-after-seizing-journalists-iphone/)** > > Post reporter was compelled to unlock MacBook Pro with fingerprint, however. --- ## Post 12 by @trilobyte — 2026-09-10T13:55:20Z I think the evidence is that apple uses telemetry to provide services. They will “backdoor” if they think they can improve the experience or security for their average user. Their average user is not the average person on this forum. There’s nothing sinister or deceptive going on, but it’s never going to be as private as Fedora, where they would not even attempt to provide these types of services. If you don’t trust the OS, the only solution is not to run it. If you do trust it, Little Snitch may provide some additional benefit by blocking some unneeded services, but isn’t strictly required. Using open source applications on macos can go a long way since, as far as I know, Apple is not harvesting data from inside third party applications. No sign in macos can be a good solution for some use cases. --- ## Post 13 by @lewasch — 2026-09-10T16:50:07Z It’s a quote from Whonix and I agree with them and GNU. [Host Operating System Selection - Whonix](https://www.whonix.org/wiki/Host_Operating_System_Selection) --- ## Post 14 by @lewasch — 2026-09-10T16:53:52Z Backdoors are not there for law enforcement agencies like FBI. Do the FBI have access to Intel-ME and AMD-PSP backdoors? The NSA has access to every computer with AMD or intel CPU --- ## Post 15 by @Shampoo — 2026-09-10T17:03:25Z They cite the FSF article as their proof… ![image](https://forum-uploads.privacyguidesusercontent.com/original/3X/e/0/e05b50553cf36220e96ecd0dd69467aacdce5389.png) ![image](https://forum-uploads.privacyguidesusercontent.com/original/3X/6/f/6fd469acebb87aeba4edcb531a11e9780b33ead9.png) This is just them repeating the first article so it doesn’t provide additional support for your claims. --- ## Post 16 by @lewasch — 2026-09-10T17:03:27Z They don’t --- ## Post 17 by @lewasch — 2026-09-10T17:04:09Z They do not cite them if they do not agree --- ## Post 18 by @Shampoo — 2026-09-10T17:07:36Z It gets worse. Madaidan even said this in the thread discussing that wiki page: ![image](https://forum-uploads.privacyguidesusercontent.com/original/3X/e/2/e2ba90d106bd7c0258579445654d4f672bfff5f9.png) > **[Host Operating System Selection Wiki Page Discussion](https://forums.whonix.org/t/host-operating-system-selection-wiki-page-discussion/11303)** > > This really needs a rewrite. A lot of the points are just completely inaccurate. Windows: The forced updates/upgrades are hardly “backdoors”. Would you rather have millions of people forget to update and their computers become seriously... --- ## Post 20 by @lewasch — 2026-09-10T17:28:37Z I do not agree with every claim of GNU and I can see why it is not a good source for the Whonix wiki. I do think a silent update without user authorization is a backdoor. Some experts agree and some disagree. Apple can use it to do targeted malicious updates. Madaidan disagree with this definition. Patrick agrees. Both agree that this update mechanism is not secure --- ## Post 21 by @trilobyte — 2026-09-10T17:49:28Z > [@lewasch](#): > > Host Operating System Selection - Whonix This is quite questionable. For example, biometrics are optional, automatic uploads are never enabled without an icloud account, apple has never deleted anything I downloaded from a competitor\*, and no applications like haveno (cryptocurrency) have ever been censored or prevented from running. MacOS falls into the “not private” spectrum of OS’s, but assertions about its current state beyond that are fear mongering. \*macOS has suggested it in the case it can’t verify the safety of the application with gatekeeper. I must click “move to trash” for it to be put in trash and then empty the trash to delete it. Note there’s no correlation between this and it being an application competing with a default macOS application. Non-competing, gatekeeper failing applications get identical treatment. --- ## Post 22 by @hydride — 2026-09-11T05:23:02Z > [@trilobyte](#): > > I think the evidence is that apple uses telemetry to provide services. They will “backdoor” if they think they can improve the experience or security for their average user. Their average user is not the average person on this forum. There’s nothing sinister or deceptive going on, but it’s never going to be as private as Fedora, where they would not even attempt to provide these types of services. > > If you don’t trust the OS, the only solution is not to run it. If you do trust it, Little Snitch may provide some additional benefit by blocking some unneeded services, but isn’t strictly required. > > Using open source applications on macos can go a long way since, as far as I know, Apple is not harvesting data from inside third party applications. No sign in macos can be a good solution for some use cases. Most of telemetry is optional. If they violate privacy policy, competitors will be eager to report. --- ## Post 23 by @hydride — 2026-09-11T05:24:22Z Another false claim without evidence. And you can barely never prove a vulnerability is intentional. --- ## Post 24 by @not-wittingly — 2026-09-11T06:54:11Z > [@hydride](#): > > Any proofs I just mean the PRISM program Snowden leaked back in the day. I thought it was pretty well founded that Apple was collaborating with the NSA. --- ## Post 25 by @anon67953901 — 2026-09-11T07:02:23Z > [@not-wittingly](#): > > I just mean the PRISM program Snowden leaked back in the day. I thought it was pretty well founded that Apple was collaborating with the NSA. They’ve introduced E2EE for most iCloud products so that may allow them to avoid giving that data over for users who opt-in. It would be an incredible thing for our privacy if Apple turned it on by default for all users. The new recording feature (weird) is at least E2EE by default so you can’t even turn if off, like Health, which is good. --- ## Post 26 by @trilobyte — 2026-09-11T13:17:05Z > When you create an Apple Account, apply for commercial credit, purchase and/or activate a product or device, download a software update, register for a class at an Apple Store, connect to our services, contact us (including by social media), participate in an online survey, or otherwise interact with Apple, we may collect a variety of information, including: > > - **Account Information.** Your Apple Account and related account details, including email address, devices registered, account status, and age > > - **Device Information.** Data from which your device could be identified, such as device serial number, or about your device, such as browser type > > - **Contact Information**. Data such as name, email address, physical address, phone number, or other contact information > > - **Payment Information. Data about your billing address and method of payment, such as bank details, credit, debit, or other payment card information** > > - **Transaction Information.** Data about purchases of Apple products and services or transactions facilitated by Apple, including purchases on Apple platforms > > - **Fraud Prevention Information.** Data used to help identify and prevent fraud, including a device trust score > > - **Usage Data.** Data about your activity on and use of our offerings, such as app launches within our services, including browsing history; search history; product interaction; crash data, performance and other diagnostic data; and other usage data > > - [Location Information](https://developer.apple.com/support/app-privacy-on-the-app-store). Precise location only to support services such as Find My or where you agree for region-specific services, and coarse location > > - **Health Information.** Data relating to the health status of an individual, including data related to one’s physical or mental health or condition. Personal health data also includes data that can be used to make inferences about or detect the health status of an individual. If you participate in a study using an Apple Health Research Study app, the policy governing the privacy of your personal data is described in the [Apple Health Study Apps Privacy Policy](https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/apple-health-studies/). > > - **Fitness Information.** Details relating to your fitness and exercise information where you choose to share them > > - **Financial Information.** Details including salary, income, and assets information where collected, and information related to Apple-branded financial offerings > > - **Government ID Data.** In certain jurisdictions, we may ask for a government-issued ID in limited circumstances, including when setting up a wireless account and activating your device, for the purpose of extending commercial credit, managing reservations, or as required by law > > - **Other Information You Provide to Us.** Details such as the content of your communications with Apple, including interactions with customer support and contacts through social media channels > > You are not required to provide the personal data that we have requested. However, if you choose not to do so, in many cases we will not be able to provide you with our products or services or respond to requests you may have. > > … > > Apple may receive personal data about you from other **individuals** , from businesses or third parties acting **at your direction** , from our **partners** who work with us to provide our products and services and assist us in security and fraud prevention, and from other lawful sources. > > - **Individuals.** Apple may collect data about you from other individuals — for example, if that individual has sent you a product or gift card, invited you to participate in an Apple service or forum, or shared content with you. > > - **At Your Direction.** You may direct other individuals or third parties to share data with Apple. For example, you may direct your mobile carrier to share data about your carrier account with Apple for account activation, or for your loyalty program to share information about your participation so that you can earn rewards for Apple purchases. > > - **Apple Partners.** We may also validate the information you provide — for example, when creating an Apple Account, with a third party for security, and for fraud-prevention purposes. > **[Legal - Apple Privacy Policy - Apple](https://www.apple.com/legal/privacy/en-ww/)** They don’t need to violate this for it to be non-private. Of course, much of this is related to the optional icloud account, but device activation and the like is non-optional. They can also change the privacy policy at any time. They also track in person purchases at an Apple store and such, so the tracking goes beyond the device itself. Whether or not “most” can be disabled isn’t a factor in comparing to a system like Fedora, as we should be concerned about how macOS _after_ such a setup compares with Fedora. We will see much more telemetry on macOS. Additionally, if someone plans to disable gatekeeper and the like, it’s unclear to me why they would use macOS unless they need a specific macOS only program. Once you disable icloud and macOS security features, you just have a very constrained unix system.